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@selah-chelyah: alright! Let’s get into this!

Ok so you said

“And I think the “heavenly gift” could be Christ or the Holy Spirit as it is still a gift, even if not received!”

And I totally agree. I think I over complicated things earlier so I’ll try and be clearer! : D

““It’s possible to have intellectual knowledge of the word and an experience of God and not be saved.”

But are you saying you agree or disagree with that statement?”

 

Depending on the quality of the experience yes. Let’s just make that a ‘I agree’ s for simplicity’s sake.

 

“So, your writing style is a bit tough to understand… are the two “maybe`s” Jesus or the Holy Spirit being the “heavenly gift” referred to in the verse? If so, then that seems somewhat beside your point.”

 

Ya it was XD sorry, I got kinda rambly! All I was attempting to say was this: I don’t believe we can say ‘enlightened’ certainly only means intellectual knowledge and ‘tasted of the heavenly gift’ (heavenly gift referring to God, either in the form of the Holy Spirit or Jesus) certainly means only a physical or surface level experience and not an intimate one. That’s all I was trying to say but, at this point, I’m willing to assume both true for the sake of the argument

: D.

 

“The Greek word used, although, is photizo, which is translated, “to give light by knowledge or teaching”. It means to be mentally aware of something, to be instructed or informed. But it does not carry any note of response…. of acceptance or rejection, belief or disbelief. No life changing relationship there.”

 

sorry, I don’t quite know what this is referring too… However, since I think it has to do with my whole confusing bit on heavenly gifts I’m just going to ignore it for now. (sorry, I didn’t mean to be confusing with that ‘heavenly gift’ bit!)

 

“Okay, by your own standards you cannot say something is crazy unless you prove why, so that point was invalid!”

 

ok uh, which point is that? I actually have no Idea which point your referring too. XD here you know what, I’ll list the points I want make below to try and clear things up!

 

Premise 1: Hebrews 6 is talking about what were true, saved believers:

EVIDENCE: they are said to have ‘partaken of the Holy Spirit’ and, as you said “I agree that the Holy Spirit is the seal of true Christianity”. These people have partaken of the Holy spirit, thus they were true christians.

 

Premise 2: Hebrews 6 also says these people really lost their salvation.

EVIDENCE: “and then have fallen away, it is impossible to renew them again to repentance” the term ‘fall away’, as earlier discussed, means ‘to be unfaithful’ or ‘to abandon or renounce’. And the phrase ‘it is impossible to renew them to repentance’ shows they are no longer repentant.

 

Conclusion: True believers can lose their salvation.

 

Ok, that feels good! So you were saying

 

“they had reached that point of repentance at the full revelation of truth spoken of, and he was warning them not to go back because it would be impossible of them to come back up to that point of repentance after rejecting it. ”

 

Which is a good argument. It just doesn’t work if the believers were actually saved, actually true christians. So prove that the people in Hebrews were not saved and you’ve won. : D

 

If you don’t mind I would like to come to a conclusion on this first : D (also, I’m slightly scared for my second verse XD)

 

Thanks for talking to me and I look forward to hearing your response!

 

@serenity: Ok cool! Appealing to mystery is great XD.

 

@catwing: “Oh… Why do you not like hearing other people’s dreams?” The way I see it dreams are like mind barf XD. You don’t have control over them (although I guess that’s kinda debatable…) their 90% random and mostly useless. HOWEVER, I might, if you really want me to, put up with you dreams if you care to share them… maybe XD. But ya, thats my thoughts on dream sharing!

 

Thinks for a minute. What’s scarier than the dark?… Ok, ya. I have no idea what your worst nightmare is XD