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@theinconceivable1

Okay… I will start by replying to your last question, because I meant to reply to it, but forgot.

I strongly believe it is okay to kill in the defense of another person. That does not mean it is my first choice, but if I have to go there, I will. As for self defense I still believe it is permitted, though I may not be so fast to kill the person if I am the only one in danger. I would far rather not have to kill anyone, ever. But that being said, I would like to acknowledge that it is a choice we have to make that decision from study of scripture, and listening to our conscience (as @eden-anderson said). If it goes against your conscience, under almost no circumstance should you defy that.

 

Oh! You believe we can loose our salvation? Um… *holds tongue so as not to go off topic*

I can accept that you still disagree the… (at this point I’m replying to what you said, from the bottom up)

And how we pair action with faith, I would say is this: God gives us the means by which to act. We have faith that he will watch over us, and give prepare, while also telling us to prepare as well. We still have a duty, he tells us what to do, in his word. And we trust that he will provide, as he sees fit, that he will give us what we need to prepare. That is how I would answer that.

And just to clarify… I believe Peter had the sword for purpose of self defense, but I don’t think Jesus had him put it away because self defense was wrong.

And you are correct, I wasn’t using that to justify self defense, just pointing out that Jesus did not always call the apostles to passiveness, and that they did bring out justice.

As I said farther up, I am definitely for defense of others, but I also believe in individual defense, though I might not kill someone in self defense, where I might in defense of others. I don’t think it’s condemned to kill in self defense, and I don’t think it’s spoken against, and I see that it is even shown as okay in scripture. Now, that being said, I train myself to have more options, which allow me maybe not to kill, and to fight effectively without killing. I don’t want to be left to my life vs the bad guy’s life.

I’m not saying that God enforced what he said in Genesis… but he did leave natural causes that were devastating. And on top of that we are still expected to listen to God’s command whether he punishes us visibly or not. Did any of those polygamists come out of that favorably? No. (btw… Neither Issac nor Joseph committed polygamy)

And no, I’m not claiming innocence in God’s silence, but it would seem that these actions were approved of.

And yes… we can look into that later.

Now! By way of furthering my argument: “Then the three mighty men broke through the camp of the Philistines and drew water out of the well of Bethlehem that was by the gate and carried and brought it to David. But he would not drink of it. He poured it out to the LORD” We read hear (in 2 Samuel 23:16), that three men went out into battle, and fought their way to water, for their king. They are not fighting because their king is in direct danger, they put themselves forth for their king, fighting in self defense and defense of the others, for the preservation of the life of their king. They know that if they die, they can no longer serve and protect their king… so they fight to ensure that they can continue doing that. And then David offers the water to the LORD. Thus I think we can assume that the water was not gotten by evil means.

@seekjustice, I have seen it and it is now at the top of my favorites list. I highly admire how he stood up like that.