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  • Joy C. Woodbury posted an update 10 months ago

    @scoutfinch190 Hi! Glad to see you here on SE.

    • It’s good to see you too! How’s your book going?

      • It’s going okay! May expand it into a trilogy, actually. Are you doing NaNoWriMo this year?

      • How cool! My WIP is lagging, and I need to organize my ideas.
        I didn’t think of joining NaNoWriMo this year… but now you mention it, I’m kinda tempted!
        I actually have had a pretty crazy year, so I’ve also been a sporadic on SE and KP. My friend moved back from out of state, and he promptly became my boyfriend and I graduated High School the day before I got engaged. Then, after four months of blood, sweat, and tears, we got married and a week later moved into our apartment (I also wanted to briefly add that I’m 19). Considerably better than 2020, but crazier and I learned I’d rather plan a novel than a wedding.

      • Wow! It definitely sounds like you’ve been busy. (I mean, getting engaged and then married… wow. XD) I’m so happy for you – that’s really exciting! But I bet it took some getting used to, for sure. Congratulations to you and your new husband!
        I’m working on a novella for NaNo. Not sure if it will expand into a novel or not… maybe a longer novella at least. But I’ve been enjoying it although it has themes I’ve never delved into before.

      • Thank you! It all felt pretty natural, but yes, it certainly is an adjustment.
        How interesting! What themes are you thinking of exploring?

      • You’re welcome! Yeah, I bet. XD
        Ah yes, so the novella is focusing on themes of justice and injustice, crime and punishment, judgment and mercy, and where compassion and love enter into all that. The main question I’m exploring is “Is an act of violence ever permissible if it is done to protect and save someone else?” I’ve just been thinking really hard about that lately and felt compelled to address it in writing – if I do so, maybe I can discover some answers for myself. XD

    • That’s so interesting! Sounds like you have your work cut out for you! Are you taking a break from your historical fiction in Bible times (is it called Biblical fiction?)
      I think one of the themes I will be exploring in my WIP is reconciliation and forgiveness (my WIP is a continuation of my short story Ice).

      • Yup, I sure do! XD
        Yeah, I’m taking a bit of a hiatus from my Biblical fiction for now because I actually decided to expand my novel into a trilogy. Right now I’m kind of mulling over what that will look like and imagining titles for the books… so when I finish the novella, I’ll probably start outlining book one of the trilogy.
        Those are great themes! Some of my favorites for sure. My Biblical fiction trilogy focuses heavily on forgiveness and redemption. (Also, if I remember correctly, I think I’ve read Ice. Is that the one about Fabian?)

    • How cool! Those themes are some of my favorites, too 🙂 . Will you have one POV or multiple?
      Yes, it’s the one about Fabian and his brother Jake. I also hope to have Marian and a couple new characters to be introduced later play a big part in it, but I still have very little clue of what happens next. besides reconciliation happening, with a splash of poetic justice and a villain… happening.

      • I’m going to have multiple POVs! Each of the three books is named after a character (first book named after Temira, Paul’s sister; the second after Naamah, a woman who endured persecution from Paul in his pre-conversion days; and the third after Seth, Paul’s adopted nephew). In each book, though, there will be other POVs besides the one from the character the book is named after. And since the trilogy is called The Apostle’s Sister, each book keeps Paul’s sister (Temira) as the center. Since she’s the center of the trilogy, obvi. XD
        Ooh, that sounds so fun! I love reconciliation and poetic justice. And you can never have enough villains! I honestly like antags a lot better than protags…

    • That’s awesome! What style of narrative are you doing? (Like first person or third person?)

      Your trilogy sounds so interesting btw!

      I have multiple POVs in my WIP, I think about four at the moment, i may pare it down to three.
      Thank you! I’ve definitely had a weakness for themes of reconciliation for nearly all the time I’ve been into writing.
      I really like antagonists and protagonists equally, it really depends on how they’re done. I really like anti-heroes that change or heroes that provide good examples.

      • Thank you!!
        I’m doing third person because I kind of feel like it fits better with the genre – also because in general, I prefer writing in third person by far. It just comes more natural to me, I guess!
        Cool! Which raises a question… do you think there should be a limit to how many POVs a writer includes? I think it definitely depends on whether the readers actually need to get into this character’s head to understand the story. The first two books of my trilogy will likely have only two POVs, Temira’s and Naamah’s, while the third will add Seth to the bunch (he actually isn’t introduced into the story until book three). There’s also another character whose POV I’m considering adding to one or more of the books, but I haven’t yet decided if it’s necessary. I think POVs can get to an excess if writers aren’t careful.
        Same here!
        Personally, my favorite characters are the villains who are actually kind and loving people at heart (or started off that way), and who consequently come off as more tragic than villainous. But I also like a wise, virtuous mentor or a protag with a heart of gold.

      • I’d agree with you. I’m guessing that the amount of POV’s needed is what works best with the story, that being pretty much the most hard-and fast rule.
        if there was a detective that had to listen to multiple recaps of the same event that drastically changed each time, or something that had many different POVs with only part fo the story, then more POVs is understandable. but i think that it’s easy to go overkill and moderation is necessary. To my memory, the most POV’s I’ve seen is 6 over the span of a trilogy, and the author even did several different types of narrative to suit the personality of the characters. It wasn’t my favorite, but she did a good enough job.
        I also love the morally upright characters and villains who at their heart have the potential to be good people. I remember one example from the children’s show Avatar: The Last Airbender that i think may interest you. He started out as an antagonist that seemed at first glance to be nothing but a obsessive villain, but as he was revealed to the audience, it was shown that his tough personality was covering his trauma-scarred past and he was really just hurting and fighting for his abusive father’s approval. I also learned a lot from observing his redemption arc by getting to see how while he gradually improves over the course of the story, he often backslides and it made me realize that that was part of what made his change so realistic.

    • True!
      Personally, I like it best when authors use third-person for multiple POVs (if there are more than two POVs in the story). Having 6 POVs all in first person gets super confusing super fast, unless the author is incredibly skilled in making their voices distinctive. Even so, it can still get confusing to keep track of all the different voices.
      Ooh, that villain sounds SO good! In addition, I have a soft spot for the villains with redemption arcs. Those are the absolute best – probably because they’re so realistic and relatable, like you said.
      Who’s your favorite morally upright character? Mine is Monseigneur Myriel-Bienvenu from Les MisĂ©rables. He doesn’t get much spotlight in the musical or movie, so you’d have to read the book to truly understand how amazing his character is. He’s serious, godly, and benevolent, but also witty and has a sense of humor that I absolutely LOVE. What I love best is how different he is from the other members of the Catholic clergy. At a time when the high-ranking religious, especially bishops like Myriel, hoarded wealth, he gives his palace up to be a hospital, serves the poor, and has no carriage. One of my favorite scenes is the one where he visits a criminal condemned to the guillotine (whom another clergy member refused to see) and stays with him the whole time, talking to him of the mercy of God and accompanying him to the place of execution. It’s amazing.

      • Les Miserables sounds so interesting! I’ll have to read it soon!

        One time when i read a series with differing POVs, there were a few in first-person, one in first-person present-tense, and then two more in third person. It was interesting, but not my favorite.

        I totally have a weakness for redemption arcs… for awhile, it was so easy to just save all my villains… even one I hate as a person got saved in the rough draft. (I really hate this villain as a person, but as a villain, he’s great… but he’s such a manipulative abuser and fanatical and makes me want to wash my hands in bleach… he’s a sort of dark twist on the handsome, good vampire that partakes in a romance trope (is it even a trope??? I mostly know of it from hearsay… I’ve never read a vampire romance)).

      • Ooh, I was actually considering doing something like that for one of my WIPs. (One POV in first person and the others in third.) As a general rule, though, I like it better when a book has a consistent POV, because otherwise it can be jarring, so I decided that’s what I’d rather stick with in my own writing.

        I read a novel recently where one of the three POVs was in first while the other two are in third. It honestly took me quite a while to figure out, “Why does this one POV seem different somehow?” XD

        Redemption for villains may or may not be one of my favorite things EVER. I honestly wish every villain I write could be redeemed, too… but unfortunately that’s not how the cookie crumbles. XD The emotionally manipulative or gaslighting villains are some of the most powerful (and the scariest) in my opinion.

        I’ve never read a vampire romance either – nor do I really wish to since it isn’t my kind of thing – but I have heard of them. Mostly from my friends who watch Twilight. XD

    • Having one POV in first and the others in third I I think would work well if the first-person narrator was describing the other two POVs along with his own, but I’m not sure how else that would really make sense besides the author trying to push the envelope.

      I know! I love redemption arcs, but, alas, justice also exists. In fact, I’m wondering how to incorporate justice for my MC in his redemption arc… him being an outlaw and all.

      And I would agree, the most intimidating villains are the ones that are ruthless and manipulative. I have a villain like that, and I really look forward to his demise even though it’s a bit tragic.

      I’ve only gathered so much knowledge of vampire romance from hearsay, mostly from what I’ve heard of Twilight… but my story takes place in a more steampunk-Victorian(or Edwardian??)-esque world.

      Yeah, vampire romance isn’t my thing either. I’ve heard enough to kinda understand the gist of it, but I don’t want to dive into the genre since it’s probably very dark and borders on erotica.

      How’s your WIP coming? I know it’s been a few months since you posted. Mine’s been actually moving forward for once, and I’ve recently finished a very rough draft of the second installment in the series. I’ll probably post it on the forum once I’ve finished cutting out some scenes.

      • Agreed. I think having one consistent type of POV probably keeps things simpler for both the author and reader. XD

        *perks up* An outlaw character arc? That already sounds so good… but yeah, I can see how it would be tough!

        Oh, yeesh! Yeah, I think the manipulative villains are the scariest because they’re the ones you’re most likely to meet in real life.

        I definitely agree with you about the vampire romance. It’s just too dark for my taste, and I don’t see how an author can pull it off while also being appropriate.

        So I finished my novella! I’m going back to working on my Biblical fiction series now. I ordered two New Testament study guides, and once I get the timeline straight, I think I’ll be able to jump into a first draft of the first book. I’m so excited!

        That sounds awesome! Congrats on your progress. I’d like to read it when it goes up on the forum. 🙂

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