Myers Briggs Debate!!!

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  • #87869
    His Bard
    @his-bard

    Well, “all history is written by the victors” is actually something I picked up from a character in Call of Duty. And while it may be a mere video game, there is actually weight to those words. The American Revolution, the Civil War, WW1, WW2, Vietnam, the American Civil War, the French Revolution, the War of the Roses, any other conflict through history, the politically correct viewpoint always seems to be the victor’s, and the loser’s viewpoint, whether right or wrong, gets covered over.

    “Not all that is written is necessarily true” was a play on Tolkien’s “all that is gold does not glitter”, other than that I didn’t quite have the exact quote in my head, and I was thinking ‘not all that glitters is gold’. But at any rate, there are plenty of falsehoods that are broadly accepted as truth (for example evolution, among a million other things) but that are obviously still not true just cause they’re written in books everywhere.

    And the last part is my mission statement. I believe in searching for answers to every question, and questioning every answer till I can satisfy myself that its absolute truth.

    Its honestly been too long since I’ve read much history, ever since I signed my life away to a paying job 🙁
    But my areas of interest are the Scottish War for Independence, the American Revolution, and the American Civil War. Given how long its been since I’ve read any such material, I will refrain from starting any arguments on what is or is not fact regarding those eras. Although I did find it interesting to note that the Civil War happened at the same time as the Oregon Trail and all that westward expansion, and many settlers may well have been Southern sympathizers who realized the South’s impending defeat and wanted to start their lives all over from scratch. This is an idea that I will eventually be exploring in my current primary project, which has completely abandoned its origins as a speculation about my imaginary twin, and instead become a story about a fictional nation of city-states, originally founded in that time period, and its role in the current world.

    Spoken words are forgotten. Written word lasts forever. Writers are the most powerful mortals to exist.

    #87871
    His Bard
    @his-bard

    I’m glad you’re enjoying this, btw, cause honestly, so am I.

    Spoken words are forgotten. Written word lasts forever. Writers are the most powerful mortals to exist.

    #88025
    Selah CJW
    @selah-chelyah

    @his-bard

    Okay, I mostly agree with you about the American Revolution…you don’t see much British history on that, as all the British generals did a horrible job and slaughtered a lot of brave and otherwise-victorious soldiers needlessly. Pretty humiliating war for them, to say the least, esp when you consider their history and where Britain was at that point in time. :_ And the Vietnam War, yeah, that is true as a general rule…unfortunately.

    The Civil War (I am assuming that when you said Civil War and then American Civil War as well, you were talking about the same war 🙂 ) , WWI, WWII…I don’t agree with you. Usually that might be what we hear, but that is more our own faults than it is anything else. Or, if we are public schooled, maybe. Otherwise, there are all kinds of documents, books, letters, diaries, all kinds of stuff that give many sides to all those wars. I would consider that to be more a personal thing…maybe someone doesn’t want to take the time to learn about the Southern side of the Civil War, or what happened when the bombs fell in Japan in WWII.

    As for the French Revolution and War of the Roses, it totally depends on what you read! I mean, that is like comparing the sides of the British Civil War between King Charles and Cromwell…people still squabble over which side was right in Britain today, just like they do about the two aforesaid wars. There are tons of books + resources from both viewpoints. I think it honestly comes down to what 1) the reader wants to read, and 2) what they’re given or have been taught was the correct view.

    I think I know what you mean in general, and it is true that the usually-propounded views of different wars are read and understood by people. If you lived in a different country, you would likely end up with a totally different idea of said war, though. Say Vietnam, or Germany, Russia, or China, or even a Pacific island or in Poland or Austria in WWII. You would have a totally different view, just like you would have hundreds of years ago if you lived in France or Spain or Prussia, vs England or Ireland, or any other nation! Every nation has it’s victorious years, as well as it’s eclipses, and thus it’s own turn to rise and fall, and write history one way or the other.

    I do believe it is true that the victors are usually remembered the longest…when you think of wars in ancient and medieval times, you usually learn of/think of the victorious side, but that is due mostly to the fact (very sadly!) that we don’t learn that much older history. I think the fact that we live in America also adds to the victor’s mentality. America has won nearly every war she every took part in, but a lot of nations can’t say that. If you lived in, say Haiti, the only “victory” you would have to look back on would be the doubtful and bloody triumph from French oppression in the uprising and subsequently brief Dominican conquest several hundred years ago, with an otherwise unbroken history of slavery, ignominy, bloody revolts, and grinding conquests. Where you live determined how you think about the world to a huge degree, even if you do study world history since time began. You mentality is still affected, as where you were born is an intrinsic part of who you are!

    Good! It’s encouraging to find someone who enjoys talking about this stuff…and you seem to know history, as well. 😛 I love your profile pic. Have you studied much on the US Military, AF, Special Ops, etc? That is one giant love and hobby of mine for sure. Especially in relation to airborne commands, it is super intriguing!

    BTW, can you type my tag out (like I do yours) so that it shows up in my email that way, and I can reply here sooner? 🙂

    Assistant Guildmaster of the Awesome Meraki
    ~ Created to create ~

    #88029
    Selah CJW
    @selah-chelyah

    @his-bard

    I forgot to reply to the rest of what you said, lol!

    But at any rate, there are plenty of falsehoods that are broadly accepted as truth (for example evolution, among a million other things) but that are obviously still not true just cause they’re written in books everywhere.

    Woah, I totally agree with you here!!!!!! You are exactly right, sad truth as it is. When I think about where our nation came from as well, it grieves me that there are SO many commonly excepted lies like that, when the very foundational principles our nation was grounded on are being chipped away at. One of my biggest reasons for being a writer, actually…seeing truth ignored and our country’s values disappearing.

    Its honestly been too long since I’ve read much history, ever since I signed my life away to a paying job  🙁

    Man, that has indeed got to be tough! I don’t work as it is not necessary + I cant for health reasons, but I can sympathize with that for sure. I devour history like nobody I know, and it would be hard to not be able to do very much of that anymore. Quite admirable, though.

     

    Assistant Guildmaster of the Awesome Meraki
    ~ Created to create ~

    #88122
    His Bard
    @his-bard

    @selah-chelyah

    “The Civil War (I am assuming that when you said Civil War and then American Civil War as well, you were talking about the same war ) , WWI, WWII…I don’t agree with you. Usually that might be what we hear, but that is more our own faults than it is anything else. Or, if we are public schooled, maybe. Otherwise, there are all kinds of documents, books, letters, diaries, all kinds of stuff that give many sides to all those wars. I would consider that to be more a personal thing…maybe someone doesn’t want to take the time to learn about the Southern side of the Civil War, or what happened when the bombs fell in Japan in WWII.”

    Lol, I didn’t even notice I did that twice…
    At any rate, I think I can agree with that for the most part. I really wish there was less stigma on everything that isn’t “politically correct”. I want to see an education system that firstly teaches critical thinking/logic/debating skills, and secondly tells all sides of a given story, leaving it up to each individual to find the truth.

    When I did that with, for example, the Civil War, my ultimate conclusion was that both the North and South were in err, and therefore someone should’ve started a new secession movement out west, learning from the mistakes of both former sides. This is exactly what I did with one of my hi-fi projects.

    Spoken words are forgotten. Written word lasts forever. Writers are the most powerful mortals to exist.

    #88314
    Selah CJW
    @selah-chelyah

    @his-bard

    Lol, it probably didn’t seem like tagging me helped in replying sooner! I have been offline for a few days…sorry it has taken me so long to reply. 🙂

    Yes, I know what you mean. It’s called thinking for yourself instead of brainwashing, which I believe is what happens every day at schools, colleges, etc… across the nation. Besides which, foundational principles are being thrown to the wind and relativism is taking over.

    Really? That is a unique view! How would that have worked out, or why do you consider them both to be in the wrong, if I may ask?

    Good! It’s encouraging to find someone who enjoys talking about this stuff…and you seem to know history, as well.   I love your profile pic. Have you studied much on the US Military, AF, Special Ops, etc? That is one giant love and hobby of mine for sure. Especially in relation to airborne commands, it is super intriguing!  Did you read this? ‘Cause I’m still curious. 😀

     

    Assistant Guildmaster of the Awesome Meraki
    ~ Created to create ~

    #88394
    His Bard
    @his-bard

    @selah-chelyah

    Really? That is a unique view! How would that have worked out, or why do you consider them both to be in the wrong, if I may ask?

    Well, the south had slavery, obviously. But freeing the slaves was done all wrong, in my opinion. Britain did it 30 years before the US did, without a bloody and divisive war. And even to this day, the US still has recurring problems with racism. I think the whole thing could’ve been handled way better.

    But I think it would’ve worked for some western settlements to declare secession. They’d be too far away from the East Coast for the Union, deep in debt from the war they just finished, to do much about it till the new rebels were too strong to defeat. I see this as leading to an agreement to peacefully disagree, and the independent city-states would form a confederacy. That’s the simple version, anyway.

    Did you read this? ‘Cause I’m still curious.

    Yes, I did, and I meant to reply to that. I do study military tech, but I haven’t done as much in terms of operations/commands/tactics and that sort of thing. I do hope to get better aquainted witrh the topic in the future, though.

    • This reply was modified 1 year ago by His Bard.

    Spoken words are forgotten. Written word lasts forever. Writers are the most powerful mortals to exist.

    #88632
    Selah CJW
    @selah-chelyah

    @his-bard

    *facepalms*  Thanks for tagging me again, my family and I are working through a ton of health-related stuff right now and I’ve (obviously) been offline for several days. 🙂

    I see what you mean, and I agree with you there. Still I consider the whole northern/Union side of things to be in the right during the war, though. I mean, I totally agree with what they were fighting for, even if higher-ups did not do a competent job of cleaning up afterwards. I think a lot of things would have been far different if Lincoln had not been assassinated when he was! Hmm! That is an interesting thought. Why would they do that instead of remaining united?

    Sure. I have not done a lot in that arena, either, mostly first-hand accounts and history from the front lines. I find it really interesting, though!

    Assistant Guildmaster of the Awesome Meraki
    ~ Created to create ~

    #93036
    His Bard
    @his-bard

    @selah-chelyah

    Got so busy with life that I hven’t logged on in a couple months…

    Anyway,

    That is an interesting thought. Why would they do that instead of remaining united?

    In real history, probably no real reason for the west to start a second secession, other than because they probably could’ve gotten away with it.

    But in my story timeline, the town that sparks the new secession movement is under the leadership of individuals who are fed up with Federal over-reach. They disagree with the Civil War, they disagree with all the conflicts with the Native Americans, they feel that the government is very quickly reverting back to a state of ‘taxation without representation’, and various other issues as well, which drives them to the decision to start over. And in modern times, this autonomous government is really glad that it did what it did when it did it, cause its shaking its head at the US and how we are, in real life, controlled by two corrupt political parties, how we’ve been in a constant state of war for over 30 years, and how we brought ourselves to the brink of financial collapse.

    I know at this point, my story sounds like its built on top of all kinds of conspiracy theories. And to be 100% honest, it is. But throughout life, I’ve seen evidence which seems to suggest many conspiracies, myths, legends, etc are often based on some element of truth. Which is why I run with them so much. I’m not declaring any conspiracies to be true, nor am I declaring wrong what we’ve been taught in our history books. All I want to do is incite questions, get more people interested in digging for truth, regardless of whatever that actual truth might turn out to be.

    Spoken words are forgotten. Written word lasts forever. Writers are the most powerful mortals to exist.

    #93038
    His Bard
    @his-bard

    I feel like we are extremely not discussing the actual topic this thread was made for. XD
    Perhaps we should create a new thread…

    Spoken words are forgotten. Written word lasts forever. Writers are the most powerful mortals to exist.

    #93067
    Selah CJW
    @selah-chelyah

    @his-bard

    Wow, I totally agree with you there. I have recently read some stuff that has changed my mind on some of this, as well. 🙂

    Agreed, lol. I will start a new thread with a reply to your above post, and we can continue on there.

    @theinconceivable1

    Sorry to take over your topic, dude. XD

    Assistant Guildmaster of the Awesome Meraki
    ~ Created to create ~

    #93068
    theinconceivable1
    @theinconceivable1

    @selah-chelyah: First, you changed your profile pic AGAIN! XD Seccond, don’t even worry about it… I’m never on here anymore anyway ; D

    INTJ- trying to grow into real wisdom; James 3:17

    #93077
    Selah CJW
    @selah-chelyah

    @theinconceivable1

    Yes, I did. 😛

    Haha, okay…even if you are never on here again, though, I will never forget how to type out your tag, Prince Inc. XD

    Assistant Guildmaster of the Awesome Meraki
    ~ Created to create ~

    #93078
    theinconceivable1
    @theinconceivable1

    @selah-chelyah good to know my legacy lives on… XD

    INTJ- trying to grow into real wisdom; James 3:17

    #93081
    Selah CJW
    @selah-chelyah

    @theinconceivable1

    Undoubtedly, eternally.

    I noticed you changed your signature…again. XD I really like it, too!

    Assistant Guildmaster of the Awesome Meraki
    ~ Created to create ~

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