Avengers: Endgame Discussion Thread (Here Be Spoilers)

Forums Fiction General Writing Discussions Avengers: Endgame Discussion Thread (Here Be Spoilers)

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    Josiah DeGraaf

    @coggleton Yeah–I’m pretty sure CA gave Mjolnir back to Dark World era-Thor.

    Yeah–either a Lex Luthor or someone who can actually go toe-to-toe with her seems necessary here.

    That would have been neat. It’s interesting that as central as the stones were, we didn’t see a ton of their unique powers in the films outside of IW for the most part (thinking of the Reality stone in particular here, though also the soul stone–did we ever get to see what that did?)

    Lit fanatic. Eclectic reader. Theology nerd. Writing fantasy at https://josiahdegraaf.com


    I enjoyed the movie. They did a good job tying up the loose ends and delivered a satisfying conclusion which is impressive considering all the expectations that have been building up over the course of all the previous films.

    I am very confused by the plot holes and paradoxes involving the whole time travel but I suppose that just comes with the territory. I agree that Captain Marvel is too overpowered and it seems that she was introduced to the lineup at the last minute just to be used as a plot device. She really needs a more compelling conflict to be interesting.

    I also did not like the way they handled Captain America at the end. At all. Not telling anyone of his intention to stay in the past just comes across as a needlessly rude move. Then, when asked, old Steve refuses to talk about Peggy and their happy times together when there is absolutely no reason for him not to. I get that, in terms of storytelling, this shouldn’t be told to the audience but I see no justification or motivation for old Steve to literally say, “No, I won’t tell you about her,” after ditching his friends and (to him) meeting them decades later. This really ruined the supposed poignancy and tenderness of the very last shot at the end of Steve and Peggy for me. It would have been better if that shot of Steve and Peggy had come immediately after the old Steve is asked about her.


    I can finally hop onto this thread. xD (Can I say thank you @josiah for not putting what you thought in the original post?? The temptation of reading that received notification email would have been too much.)

    Where do I start though? There is so much about this movie. Its plot. Its plot holes. Its characters. Its making (11 years process honestly). Its foreshadowing. Its tying off of lose ends. Its leaving of lose ends. Etc.

    First of all, I must say I loved the movie, but it would not have made much sense to someone who had not seen at least some of the 20-something movies that came before. I feel sorry for those who are just entering the stage of watching movies of this kind and are told they have to watch the entire series. xD

    Secondly, going off what @valtmy said about Captain America at the end… as soon as I saw him tell Bucky he couldn’t come along, I knew what was coming. But I’m pretty sure Bucky knew too.

    I’ve heard some people say that this movie had no theme, but I disagree. The difference was that the themes continued on from a long line of films. Especially the last one that focus on self-sacrifice.

    As for the plot, I really loved how it begun with them tracing down Thanos and then killing him. What… about ten or fifteen minutes into the movie?? Then it skipped five years and showed the effects on each person. That was very powerful and insightful. I liked how the plot was no longer about killing Thanos, but overcoming such devastating circumstances and banding together one last time to try to overcome it.

    I also really liked how at the end, even Thanos agreed that his idea had not worked or played out well. That the world was in even more chaos and became a bigger mess because of it. If he had not agreed – if he had not been able to recognize it – he would have been yet another inhuman villain who I can easily disregard as insane, stubborn, or not thinking clearly. The two Infinity War movies together create a powerful, thoughtful piece of work, that shows the an argument (black-and-white for me), delves deep into it, and gives me a clear, scary look at the other side of it, making me even understand the villain and his view. And then shows the consequences of those ideas. This is a dystopian story in its purest form.

    That was the main take away for me. @josiah



    This movie was so good!!! And also bad at the same time.  *goes away to sobbing place*

    I am a writer. If I seem cold, it's because I am surrounded by drafts. -Unknown Author



    When Steve said that to Bucky, you knew what was coming, I knew what was coming, Bucky knew what was coming but the others clearly did not know what was coming. They were expecting Steve to return five seconds later. It came across as though Steve did not care about them.

    In-universe, it made no sense for him to not tell everyone and say goodbye beforehand. What if he had died before being able to meet them again as an old man? He would be entering and creating a new reality. Anything could happen.

    I also get that, perhaps Peggy recently died from old Steve’s perspective. But, really, a simple, “She was the woman I lost when I got iced,” would have sufficed (As mentioned earlier I get why, from a storytelling perspective, that he went to be with Peggy shouldn’t be said. That’s why I wished the scene ended earlier than it did). In this context, “No, I won’t tell you about her,” just seems so needless and rubs me the wrong way.

    Josiah DeGraaf

    @evelyn Agreed regarding Thanos. I legit was not expecting that, and that move quickly took the story to new (and interesting!) grounds.

    Agreed regarding that line. It didn’t really fit Cap’s personality (as we knew him) very well IMO.

    Lit fanatic. Eclectic reader. Theology nerd. Writing fantasy at https://josiahdegraaf.com

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